A short interview in French
I had the joy of being interviewed (in French!) for the podcast La Pensée Visuelle en Ébullition, a podcast on everything Visual Thinking. They celebrated 3 years of their podcast and did a special birthday episode.
To celebrate, Philippe Boukobza and I had a little chat over Zoom. We talked about how sketchnoting has evolved over the years, my first steps in the field (way back when there were only a handful of us), and the growing role of visual thinking in education, collaboration, and even AI.
I also shared a few thoughts on how to get started — even if you think you “can’t draw” — and why the process of visual thinking is often more valuable than the final result.
If you speak French (and want to hear me struggling with mine…), have a listen here. My interview starts at 01:20:07.
If French is not your thing, here is a translated transcript of the interview:
Charlotte: You contacted people online and had a wonderful encounter — a truly special meeting with someone who’s a pioneer.
Philippe: Truly a pioneer. It’s undeniable. Eva-Lotta Lamm. So, we had the pleasure of speaking with her, and now we have a little excerpt for you. Listen to Eva-Lotta.
You’ve kept a very good French accent. You speak very, very well. We wanted to ask you a few questions. How do you currently see the landscape of sketchnoting in Europe — and even internationally? Are you observing any trends?
Eva-Lotta: Overall, I’d say it’s flourishing. When I started, there was no one. It was just Mike Rohde and me in the beginning. Then, little by little, more people joined. I remember following the "sketchnote" tag on Flickr, and if someone else used it — maybe every three, four, five months — someone new would pop up, and I was super excited like, “Wow, there’s someone else!” Now there are books, courses, conferences, podcasts — everything.
And I feel like it’s gradually becoming more part of public awareness — in schools, for example. It’s less rare, less “special,” and more just another technique for thinking, communicating, collaborating. The more normalized it is, the better, in my opinion.
Philippe: Thank you! Are you seeing any new trends or changes lately?
Eva-Lotta: Yes, of course — the tools. Digital tools are evolving. The iPad has been around a while now, so it's becoming fairly standard, I think.
The next big thing is artificial intelligence — how we can work with it. I use AI a lot to help with writing, brainstorming ideas, summarizing texts, and things like that. I think for visuals, it’s very good for photorealism and for complex illustrations. But for visual thinking — really making diagrams and visual structures — I’ve tried it, but I think there’s still development needed. I don’t know if it’ll get there. I imagine it will — sooner or later, everything does.
But for now, I think human intelligence is still very valuable for visual thinking — and especially for doing it yourself. Sometimes the outcome isn’t the most important thing — it’s the process. What’s happening in your own mind, and in your collaborators’ minds, as you use these tools.
Philippe: Thank you. If someone wanted to start sketchnoting, do you have any beginner tips? Where should they start?
Eva-Lotta: Yes — the most important thing is just to start. If you’re interested, the biggest obstacle is usually people thinking, “I can’t draw.” And that’s why they don’t start. But it’s not true. You just begin. That’s it.
You can also start by simply changing the way you write. Instead of writing line by line, you can begin writing in small blocks — one idea per block — and spreading them across the page. Ideas that are connected go closer together; new ones go further away. I always say that just changing how you place words on the page is the first step toward visual thinking. Like we do with post-its during brainstorming — then sorting them — that’s really the first step.
Philippe: Could you tell us about your future projects? Are you working on anything new?
Eva-Lotta: Yes, right now I just finished a new live format on Zoom. It was group practice — two-hour sessions on Zoom where we practiced together. Then we had feedback and exchanges and all that. It was a bit less like a course and more just practicing and discussing things that come up in practice, and questions. It was great — it was the first time I did it, and I think I’ll continue developing the format. It was really lovely with the group, lots of sharing.
So that’s something I’m doing. There are also small projects here and there. Things are developing, but what interests me is developing more online formats with live interaction — more exchange with the group.
Philippe: You also give talks, right?
Eva-Lotta: Yes, though right now, it’s a bit quieter. I think we’re in a bit of a low phase. I don’t know if it’s the same in France, but in Germany, it’s harder to sell courses, harder to organize conferences. That’s what my friends who organize events say too. Things are moving more slowly — but that’s just the rhythm of things.
Philippe: Okay, in any case, it was great to talk with you. You shared so many interesting and valuable things. Thank you so much. And hopefully we’ll hear from you again soon on the podcast La Pensée Visuelle en Ébullition.
Charlotte: Philippe, that was a great experience — a wonderful encounter with Eva. Yes, really incredible. She’s German, but she speaks French. We spoke in Berlin. Her ability to make things easier and more accessible is amazing. She’s a world-renowned expert. She gives talks on visual thinking at events in Japan, Australia, the U.S. And she’s very approachable, very humble.
I also really liked her focus on the specialization of information — going from linear to non-linear.
Philippe: To give a quick picture of who Eva is: since 2011, she’s been doing sketchnoting — before Mike Rohde’s book even came out in 2012. She was already sharing sketchnotes online, so she’s truly a pioneer, on par with Mike Rohde.
She held high-level roles at Yahoo and Google, working in digital and UX design. Then she quit to focus 100% on visual work. Now she runs workshops, gives talks, and publishes books.
She’s an interesting personality. She published her sketchnotes in books. There’s even one in the “Taches Rondes” series alongside Nicolas Gros and Degamora. What’s great is that she asked her friends to watch a video and then printed all the sketchnotes they made from that same video. These were professionals, and you can really see the variety — a true diversity in how each person captured the information. I think that’s wonderful to showcase.
And she also invented a term and a practice called Yoga Notes — sketchnoting for learning yoga. Another invention, another hybrid approach.
Charlotte: Thank you so much, Philippe, for this interview with Eva — it was a real pleasure to hear her.